December 1996 Archives

I don't know if you remember me from Xenobia, but I found your page and decided to send a note. I always had so much fun reading your stories, and we all do miss you. This page is wild! You had me hooked with the mission story and I spent several nights reading it all -- since I only heard such a small part of the story. I hope things are going well. I'm still struggling to get my work published. Maybe someday. Good luck and get in touch if you have time.

Hey, Maurene! Of course I remember you! I couldn't forget any of my old workshop colleagues! Thanks for the note, and let me know when you start getting published!

I think I might understand a little more about Mormonism now. (All I knew about before was from when one of my professors tried to explain it through cognitive dissonance. And I think I slept through most of it...) Thanks.

I knew a Mormon girl in high school, and she's probably quite a nice person in general, but whenever we ate lunch with the same group, at some point she'd look at me and inform me that I was depressed.

"What?" I'd say. "It's just a black sweater."

(well, not everyday I'd be wearing black, but that was the incident I remember the most. And maybe she said I was depressing, rather than depressed.)

I never found out why (maybe because I was sceptical about all faiths at the time, or because I read H.P. Lovecraft?).

My thought's projection, but then, I've taken more than my share of psychology courses.

Pointless, ne?

Not pointless. I'd put my money on projection myself.

Do you take pride in attempting to belittle the beliefs of others, warping them and taking them out of context? That is a very special gift you have, isn't it? By the account you gave of the "mormon mythology" it shows that you have a background in religious study, or at least of mormonology. It is a shame you don't have the intellectual appreciation that is the goal of the educated. To gain the understanding through an -emic perspective is much more meaningful than to only have an -etic perspective. Many can memorize and regurgitate facts and data, twisting them in an attempt to analyze them based on their own beliefs. Few are able to appreciate anothers beliefs for what they are without judging. Have any Mormons tied you up and forced you to attend their meetings or convert to their beliefs?

I don't think I have any more obligation to "appreciate" the beliefs of the L.D.S. than I do to appreciate the beliefs of the Flat Earth Society. I'm all for tolerance -- I have plenty of friends who are still members of the Church, and for the most part we get along fine. I still like my friends who smoke, too, even though I think they should probably quit. I have far less liking for the tobacco-company executives, whom I believe to be a uniformly amoral bunch. Relate this to the Mormon Church as you will -- particularly to President Gordon B. "Lied to the Cops and Helped a Murderer Get Off with a Rap on the Knuckles to Cover the Church's Ass" Hinckley.

I FIND THIS PAGE VERY DISTURBING. THE TRUTH ABOUT THE MORMONS YOU WOULD KNOW IF YOU WERE A MISSIONARY FOR TWO YEARS OF YOUR LIFETIME. YOU'D KNOW THE BELEIFS THAT WE HOLD SACRED AND DEAR. THIS PAGE IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK THE LORD WOULD BE VERY UPSET AT YOU FOR WRITTING. YOU SHOULD REALLY BE ASHAMED THAT YOU EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT WRITTING THIS WORTHLESS PIECE OF CRAP (I WOULD SAY SOMETHING DIFFERENT BUT SINCE I AM MORMON I WILL NOT)

THIS SHOULD NOT EVEN BE ALLOWED TO BE CALLED A RELIGIOUS PAGE. I DON'T EVEN REALLY WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU, BUT IF YOU DO TAKE THE TIME TO WRITE I WILL RETURN SOME TO YOU. I DON'T KNOW WHAT I WILL SAY SO LET'S NOT HAVE TOO MUCH CORESPONDENCE. THANK YOU.

You should really be ashamed that you even thought about implying the word "shit," good Mormon that you are. And what's all this hullabaloo about calling my page religious? James, James. I think your problem basically boils down to a fear of words. Unfortunately, your fear is misplaced. Words aren't the things you should fear -- you should fear the concepts behind them.

Of course, it takes a certain measure of cognitive ability to fear a concept . . .

How can you call yourself a missionary!? You preached the truth at one point in your life (more importantly our promise) and I suggest you should re-evaluate what you now think is the truth! You know that there for every action there is an opposite but equal reaction, this holds true eternally as well!!!!!!!!!!!! That is why there will be a everlasting torment for people like you who go against what you know is true! Your statements make me think of a son of perdition, how about yourself? When you come to your senses, I think that you should recall every word you have put into people's heads. In 9 months I will be out there being your opposite but equal reaction!

Your brother in truth and your enemy in disbelief.

Three points, Amos ol' buddy:

1. I don't call myself a missionary.
2. Any God that would torment me for following my conscience is a monster not worthy of my devotion.
3. You may attempt an opposite reaction, but I doubt it will be equal.

Hey, Congratulations. Glad to see your Mormon Terrorist Experience is going to be a movie. I'm sure it won't be nearly as good as the book, but . . . Must 'uv just happened today (12/13/96) 'cause I was on earlier and didn't see the update. Anyway, again, congratulations, hope you make a trillion . . . (I figure it'll take more than just a million to unseat Gordo.)

Haven't sent any feedback for a while, but I've been checkin' in regulaly to see how the folks are treating you. Feel almost sorry for the poor Aaronic Priesthood holders trying to save your soul (or convince you you're going to hell), but almost scarier is the thought that they might be Melchizedek Priesthood holders with ALL THAT POWER!!!

I like the comments you and some of your guests make about the nature of God, especially your motto, "Beware of God." Thought I was the only one who thought that way. I've figured for a long time that if God is really the way we were taught in Sunday School, Primary, MIA, and whatever other organization they had for us, I really didn't want to spend eternity with Him. I mean really, make peple take vows not to reveal secret handshakes at the expense of having your throat cut, your heart violently removed, or your bowels disemboweled??? ("Bowels disembowled??? Ok, I'm not an English Major. But it would play well in front of a jury.) But really folks, this God guy send His Only Begotten Son down to a planet where they just wanna fuck with him??? And God did this to His Only Begotten Son on purpose??? Thanks, but no thanks. Bet Jesus really wishes he were a bastard.

Keep up the good work Bill. But for Godsake . . . well, for us anyway . . . get to work on The Road to Apostasy!!! Yeah, we know, you need to earn a living, but hey, who do you think is going to go watch The Accidental Terrorist anyway???

Love ya, guy!

Thanks for the congratulations. An option doesn't guarantee that our screenplay will be made into a movie, though -- it just gives Maple Palm Productions the right to try to get the project underway for the next six months. So keep your fingers crossed that they find some big studio bucks to back them up!

Hi! You've heard from me once or twice before . . . I like to wander through your pages about once a week to see if you've been up to anything new. When I moved to a rural part of South Dakota a couple of years ago, I discovered an extremely high concentration of Mormons in the area, and as such have become quite familiar with their beliefs and lifestyle. From what I have observed, it's not really that they're such bad people, it just seems like they're so willing to accept whatever is fed to them by the church without finding any answers for themselves. At any rate, that's why I enjoy Mormon Matter; I see it all around me every day, and it's nice to see your lighthearted perspective on the Mormon world without forgetting the truly damaging effects it can have on a person's life. Hmmm. I'm not sure if that makes any sense, but hopefully you get the general idea.

Well, the real reason I wrote to you was just to say congratulations on The Accidental Terrorist being optioned. It's a great story. Best of luck to you in all of your future endeavors.

I had no idea there was a populous Mormon enclave in South Dakota. Keep on keeping the faith, and don't let 'em get you near water!

Just had to comment on the latest installment (5th) of THE ROAD TO APOSTASY. I had been planning to send you a series of feedback memos on various things but will do that later.

You are very accurate in your description of the steps required in the Mormon Church to repent. What a terrible burden to fear to have your former sins return upon you! That was NOT what I learned in the Lutheran Church that I grew up in, fortunately (or in other traditional Christian churches in general)! This is best expressed by Psalm 103:8-12 among others.

That is why this 'former Mormon investigator' will never become a Mormon. The various reasons why will take at least two or more memos! The Mormon religion is simply a heartbreakingly impossible religion to live your life by.

After reading especially about your father feeling a very worthless and vile sinner and being determined to have his children do better than he did in the Mormon Church, this thought occurred to me. Your father felt he failed to live up to his potential according to Mormon standards and felt something was wrong with him. You encountered the same impossible standards but took the thought a bit further and recognized there was something wrong with the Mormon system, period. That is one way to think about your father and his approach that he took for his family regarding the Mormon Church (why he acted the way he did).

There are many things I agree and disgree with in your web pages and the future feedback will deal with this. From your general tone of your pages, you welcome all thoughts and comments, regardless of whether you agree or not.

More later...

Yes, I generally welcome comments of any sort -- save for those like the one I received a while back from two Mormon missionaries in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio, who felt some strange need to call me "Freakboy." I can do without those. Thank you for yours.

Installment #5 very interesting. As I grew up Mormon, I too was terrified at the thought of the 2nd coming. I wonder how many of us were?

I have a teenage daughter who loves science fiction. She was reading Orson Scott Card one day, and said, "This is the plot of the book of Mormon!" Apparently he has a series out that parallels some of the Book of Mormon? Hey, maybe you can make it big with the Doctrine and Covenants. Too bad there is no plot there. Too bad my daughter wastes her time reading the Book of Mormon, but you can't blame her there since we reside in Utah.

Keep writing the story. I shall wait breathlessly for future installments.

Scott Card's five-volume Homecoming series is what you're referring to. He lifted the plot -- and several character names -- wholesale from the Book of Mormon, yes, but he managed the rather impressive feat of providing comprehensible human motivations for most of the characters. This was a Book of Mormon to which I could relate.

My compliments on this professionally executed and introspection-provoking web site. I don't agree with some of your conclusions, but your treatment of the subject matter is consistently fair, and the humanity you weave into the material is most enjoyable. You also have a talent for storytelling.

I don't know if you gave your wit and perspicacity free rein while you were a Mormon, but I hope so, for the sake of your former Ward members. There are few things as tedious as religion without a sense of humor. I refuse to believe in a God that can't take a joke.

If I may share some "f.." words: Frothing, fomenting fervor fawning as fealty fairly frequently fails to facilitate functional faith or friendly feelings.

(I have to use big words or they'll revoke my degree...)

You force me humbly to admit that I usually brought the house down when I spoke in sacrament meeting. (Not literally, like Samson, but figuratively. The long hair didn't come until later.) At my mission homecoming, I took the meeting twenty minutes overtime, and people still came up to me wiping their streaming eyes and telling me they could have listened to me talk all day. The memories almost make me want to go back to sacrament meeting . . .

When I die and St. Peter asks me if I believe the word of God to be true, and I say "No," will he let me in Heaven because I'm honest?

If there's any justice in this world (or rather, the next).

Last night I had this terrible dream that my Dad had died. I woke up crying, and although I don't think my wife knew, I was very upset over it all, and wished I could hug my dad and tell him I loved him.

I worry that some of the things that you are saying on your Road to Apostasy pages will make saying I love you to your dad all that much harder when the time comes, if you even get the chance. Remember that everything you write gets read, and if you continue to tear down your Dad, even for the wrongs he justly deserves shit for, could cause you and him to never be reconciled.

You may already be on good terms with your dad and can do this now, but re-read what you have written, keeping this in mind...

My father historically closes his ears when I talk about what he might have done better with him when I was growing up. That won't keep me from telling him that I love him, though. I do, damn him.

Not that I was -- or am now -- a perfect son. But he's free to tell the world so, and you won't hear me complain if he does.

Ran across the following joke recently. It doesn't have anything to do with Mormons, but it's got a bit of a religious theme ... well, kinda.

So, these two leprechauns approach a priest in an Irish cathedral. One of the leprechauns hangs back a bit, looking a little sheepish. The other one speaks up. "Father, are there any leprechaun nuns in this parish?"

"No, my son," answers the priest. "There are no leprechaun nuns in this parish."

"Father, are there any leprechaun nuns in Ireland," queries the leprechaun.

"No, my son, there are no leprechaun nuns in Ireland," confirms the priest.

The leprechaun who was hanging back began to get a bit restless, pulling on his buddy's arm, saying, "C'mon, we've gotta get going." But his friend persisted.

"Father," the leprechaun asked finally, "Are there any leprechaun nuns in all of this whole wide world?"

The priest replied, "No, my son, there are no leprechaun nuns anywhere in the world."

With that, the questioning leprechaun let out a boistrous laugh, turned to his friend, and jeered, "See, I told you that you boinked a penguin."

Merry Xmas.

I'm starting to think that maybe I should start a joke page all about Catholicism. Goodness knows there's plenty of material. Thanks for the good laugh!

Hey guy, the first time I wrote you I told my oldest son was headed for the Calgary Mission. Well, he's there and, it being Christmas, I called him to visit. (Missionaries sure have it easy now. When I was on my mission in Germany in 1974-76, we never had phones, or cars, or microwave ovens!!!) Anyway, I had told him before his mission to check out your web site, which he did and read the terrorist story. He found it pretty entertaining, but I think he missed the subtle jabs at Mormon theology. Today, he told me that when he raised the subject of your exploits with his companion, he was told that the members know about it, but he wasn't to talk about it!!! God, does that church just not get it or what???? Yeah, let's bury our history. He also told me that the Canadian Calgary mission under Pres. Spafford is referred to as the Canadian Country Club mission. Damn, wish I could've been there. He told me to read the Book of Mormon. I suggested he read the Koran. Missionaries ... don't you just love 'em. Just can't stop ...

Love yer page guy! See ya around.

I wish I'd realized what a country club it was at the time! Ask your son if he gets to golf for free on Mondays -- one of those ministerial perks we used to get. Until the mainstream Protestant ministers started to complain about us, that is . . .

Marvelous thoughts on the preexistence and the role of Lucifer. I've often wondered about his possible redemption and his role ... (I laughed a lot at the way you put it and I found it refreshing.) Too many take themselves and their finite knowledge too seriously...

I have experienced 3 Nephi 9:20 many times and have found peace and happiness in letting others think what they want... I often find great truths where I least expect them... I enjoyed yours.

I'm 43 have 5 children and a wonderful wife and we struggle from day to day to survive ....

I'm rather unlearned and continually seeking new thoughts and ideas....

I find tranquility and peace in worshipping the God who knelt and prayed and wept and healed ... He did this after his resurrection and still does this .. He stands to receive me with open arms and heal me and encourage me for I have many weaknessess and I BELIEVE HE STANDS WITH OPEN ARMS TO RECEIVE ANY WHO WILL HUMBLE THEMSELVES AS HE DID AND DOES AND THAT INCLUDES THE bad guy (ol darkness himself).

Yes I'm kind of a rebel when it comes to Mormon theology but ... that is what makes it so fun... stirring the water a little....

Thanks again for your humor and your thoughts. Nice web page too.

Well, here's someone who tries not to take his opinions too seriously. Heck, if I did, then I'd probably try to put a hit on God instead of just making fun of him. (See, there I go again!)